<Joyful> Happy Holidays
<^Jbb> Hello All !!!!!
<^gina^> hi jbb
<Rod> I hope everyone had a beautiful holiday :)
<MrC> huggles, gang
<Rod> Susanrose, I like the topic!
<^gina^> its a great topic
<Rod> I had thought in recent years that the beliefs
I was discovering were too cosmic
to fit neatly with the bible,
but I have seen otherwise recently.:)
<Susanrose> starting now…
We all need to breathe deep
breathing in peace....
breathe out stress
We are creating a group mind
a group intent
we are relaxing into
our best awareness.
We are all here seeing spiritual growth
We are one. We will start.
A Transformational Path for the New Millennium
First of all, I was born in 1954 in a very traditional home
and was baptized Roman Catholic. I made all the sacraments
and even attended Catholic school for 11 years.
So while some chuckle at the term "Recovering Catholic",
I have lately begun to come full circle back to Christianity,
and even some Sacraments,
as positive tools for transformation.
This may cause a few of you who have known me to say:
EEEK! What's a new age eclectic feminist priestess doing
talking about the good old patriarchal debauched RC
dogma in such sentimental terms???!!
What about the church's ruling on divorce,
and the selling of annulments?
Doesn't she remember the pope's ex-cathedra ruling
on birth control and control over women's bodies?
Doesn't she remember those murdered
in the inquisition of the burning times?
How about the Salem witch trials?
Doesn't she hear about all the priests
who took advantage of alter boys over the years?
How can Arianna/Susan Rose give into traditional
Christian Church and their years of oppression??
Well, to answer these possible questions
those may have of me, here is an eye awakening truth!
The political oppression that can occur in organized
dogmas can strike all religions.
Believe it or not, I even know a few rather patriarchal
earth-based druid and even ecological groups,
so let's not say that power structures like this
can't occur in our new awareness groups either!
Don't let some priest/bishop/pope tell you that you
Can't be a "smorgasbord" Catholic! In other words,
You are not allowed to pick out the tastiest morsels
of your Christian beliefs and incorporate them
into something sane for your life.
Who says? If all spirit is ONE,
how can some hold authority over the rest of us…?
Well, if you want to practice Christianity,
you must do it like this, or get out!
Kind of sounds like the Puritans don't it?
Didn't we need a state called Rhode Island
for all the people who couldn't do Christianity
the "Right" way?
<^Jbb> My name is Bill
and I too am a former Catholaholic... :)
<Rod> Certain elements of Christianity are timeless,
and others have been added by men
to obtain control over men.
<^gina^> I former Christian into God not dogma
<Joyful> if my ancestors had been here long ago
they would have been in Rhodes Island
<^gina^> what is Rhodes Island?
<Susanrose> a state created in the US
for religious outcasts from Massachusetts
<Joyful> the puritans were antichristmas
they said it was pagan
<^gina^> so where did the rest of Americans go????
<Susanrose> this was real early in the America history
<Susanrose> There were not too many Americans here.
For Gina, who is in New Zealand, as well as other folks,
the history of Rhode Island is interesting
look it up on the web pages... :)
<^gina^> can we define Christianity?
<Susanrose> which part of the elephant do you touch in Christianity?
There is alot of variety in it's dogmas.
<^Jbb> All religion, ritual and church mystery is dogmatic
b-s to me and not worthy of intelligent pursuit.
<^gina^> I agree Jbb
however spiritual churches can also be dogmatic.
<Rod> If we can sift through Christianity, putting aside complications
that were never intended to be there,
we can learn much.
What does the word "Catholic" mean anyway?
According to my dictionary it means universal, comprehensive.
A few years ago I got into an amazing conversation with some kind of holy
Christian spirit that was conversing with me via a medium.
I was explaining why I liked new age paganism.
I will never forget the reaction. I said well, I like to meditate!
I love the bliss that occurs through group meditation, drumming,
circles, and higher states of consciousness,
so being a Catholic for me was definitely OUT!
The spirit said in a loving yet incredulous surprised manner.
"Christians are not allowed to meditate?!?
<^gina^> they call it contemplation
<Susanrose> contemplating the mystery…
All this was news to the spirit. This frank bewilderment
at my explanation of why I could not be Catholic
any more was enough for me to step back and wonder.
Maybe I had let the powers that assumed the reigns of organized
Christianity rip away the beauty that was my birthplace and heritage.
Maybe running from the beliefs of my youth was a theft of a rich tapestry
of values that could once again comfort my heart.
If we who are recovering Catholics fell victim to oppressive rules,
maybe we should not let ourselves be victimized again
by being prodded into throwing the baby out
with the bath water when it comes to our Christian faith.
<gina> Susanrose, are you still catholic?, sorry thinking
<Susanrose> good question.
I am in a hopefully upward spiral,
where I am returning to certain Christian values, yet,
not in a circle, ... back to Christianity, but in a different
spot than I was...
Hopefully this dream will explain...
I while ago I had a dream. I was walking on a path along a stream.
I was walking with a large group of people, all seemed dressed
in eastern garb such as turbans, sari's, Chinese attire etc.
We were walking the path in the direction of the streams flow.
There were even a few adepts who were in the stream ,
walking right on top of the water.
Yet we were all headed the same directions.
I knew we would all eventually end up at Lake Erie,
as this where the stream would empty in a few miles.
On the other side of the stream, I saw people
who looked more like me. People who had western attire,
and I even saw my relatives.
Those people who I had chosen to be born
into their community. My "Tribe" .
Suddenly I was sad.
As much as I liked my eastern companions
and beliefs, knew I would enjoy the rest of the walk
back to the lake on the same side of the stream
as the rest of my kinfolk.
I did not want to miss the small talk and chatter
along the way. I saw a bridge where people
of both eastern and western culture were about
to cross back or forth. So I took my turn and crossed
the bridge and to join my "tribe".
Suddenly, my father's mother (who is passed away),
asked me to reach others with the opportunity
to re-explore Christianity.
So here I am.
I am telling you that like it or not, any false facades of Christianity
will be melt away like Tammy Faye's mascara,
when the tears of true conversion and surrender
run down our face.
Religion is just a guidepost, not a vehicle
that you must crawl into, roll up the windows,
and hang on tight for the ride to salvation.
Like Clinton's indiscretions, this is a time
when all our skeletons are brought to light,
to be cleansed. Just as Bill and all of us must face
the music, so too are traditional churches being tested.
There is an annual feminist rally called
"Take Back the Night".
It is to proclaim that women will not hide
in our homes at night just because we fear violence.
Likewise, those of us who have rejected
organized religion, can join together to
"Take Back Christianity!
It can become magical again,
a source of comfort and joy, and easily transportable
to the new millennium.
<Rod> Christianity, in its simplest ideals is beautiful.
Here are some examples of people re-tuning
Christianity to help them understand and integrate
the many truths.
Many biker groups that are having bible studies
and call themselves "Bikers for Jesus".
They are finding a lot of joy in it,
and while maintaining their non-conformist personalities,
they are still finding the power to overcome addictions
to alcohol, drugs, and are building a loving community.
By the way, the book "God on a Harley"
was also a fine example of letting the Christ take
expression in unexpected ways.
Author Carolyn Myss, in her book,
"Anatomy of the Spirit --
The Seven Stages of Power and Healing"
Explains the sacraments in terms of the chakras.
Starting at the Root Chakra with baptism,
she works her way up the body, explaining each of the
seven sacraments. Hearing her explain it, almost
made me want to go to church next Sunday!
Can you be a Feminist as well as a Catholic?
Many groups of nuns are becoming more feminist.
My daughter's grade school principal was among the last
to know when the patriarchal powers of the diocese slated
her school for closure.
Last I heard, she was on retreat/sabbatical where
she is re-evaluating, and exploring
Yoga, meditation, healing and holistic life styles.
Holy smokes, I thought, if more Catholics like her
want to get out the aroma therapies and meditate
their way to bliss, then It might be time for even me
to give the Christian/catholic experience an other chance!
For interesting links on the feminist themes in Christianity see:
Christian + Feminist
This is a page is dedicated to the proposition that faith
and feminism are not mutually exclusive.
<JOY-FUL> I think historically women need the
garden of eden Eve's story conclusion modified
I would end the story like this:
it took evil itself to take woman off the path
but only woman to take man off
<Susanrose> I was once in a spirit filled congregation
that had 500 people from 3 states gather weekly
all because of the good news and joy encouraged
by the priest
<JOY-FUL> many Christian churches
shy away from spirit filled Christians
<^gina^> agree joyful
<miKron> JOY-FUL all mikron hopes ever is people realize their own creative power within!
<JOY-FUL> I hope you are able to reconnect in the way you seek
<Susanrose> Thank you Mikron!
<JOY-FUL> I think we all agree with that but .....
wouldn't the church call that blasphemy
<Susanrose> duh! Who died and left them boss?
(don't believe what they say!)
<Rod> Beware any churches that exist to control people or separate people. ; )
<^Jbb> Hoooya, Rod!
<^gina^> or any sects and groups for that matter
<miKron> Let us all find the deepness in the heart
chakra so we can know the Truth for ourselves!
<Susanrose>I don't know about you, but I am real tired
of having to defend myself as being a "new ager".
In some fundy- land thinking
"new age" has become a dirty word.
But alternative versions of Christianity have been around a long
if you want to go back to The Gnostic Gospels,
as old as Christianity itself. Since dogma is written by the winners,
it must be evaluated with the discernment of the heart.
After all, it was way back in 1968 that I had my first brush
with what was to become new age consciousness.
At that time I read "Edgar Cayce's Story of Jesus",
and joined a Cayce Study Group.
For more on Jesus, see the previous log:
"The Man and Myth....
Sharing Alternative Tales of Jesus the Christ."
To quote the post resurrection words of Jesus
in the Aquarian Gospel:
"My human life was wholly given to bring my will
to tune with the deific will...
My life was one great drama for the sons of men,
a pattern I lived to show the possibilities of man.
What I have done all men can do,
and what I am all men shall be. "
Another telling of the true meaning of Christmas
Comes recently channeled per
"JESHUA" through JUDITH COATES
Here is what JESHUA says:
"Beloved one, you have a most wonderful story
recorded in your holy scriptures,
it is a story that tells of my birth.
In truth you may read it on many levels.
It is a story, it is as a vehicle for meaning.
On the one hand it will
be as you would have recorded history
of the birth of one man.
One who seemingly demonstrated divine gifts, and I
did, but one who seemingly was above you --
and I am not above you. I am
your equal. You are my equal.
You are Christ incarnate as well.
That is how wonderful you are.
Christmas is about your Christ-mas
Not to celebrate a birth that happened two thousand years
ago, was over and done with,
and was someone who was seen to be so holy
that he must be separate from you --
but to celebrate in this day and
time the birth of Christ which is you
and to receive that gift that you
had prayed for, hoped for,
and almost didn't expect you could receive.
Knowing that you are so loved that
you are Christ incarnate yourself
and that you may celebrate and sing,
"Glory to God in the highest and
peace to my fellow brothers and
sisters. Good will and love to all."
Go and give the gift of the Christ to yourself
and to others and I guarantee to you this Christmas
will be more wonderful than you have ever known.
A question posed to Jeshua:
MANY RELIGIOUS SECTS TALK ABOUT
THE SECOND COMING OF CHRIST.
ARE THERE SIGNS OF THE SECOND COMING?
Yes. The signs, as you have termed them,
are all around you. Have you felt an acceleration
upon this plane, an acceleration of the holy Child
wanting to know Who he/she is?
Have you witnessed a growing awareness
of oneness with our Holy Mother the Earth,
which is manifesting as a wave of interest in the ecology
-- a green awareness, I think it is called?
Have you seen more of the brothers and sisters
coming together in small groups, communities,
to support and help each other?
Even the ones that would be seen to be "acting out,"
in violence are crying out, with grand intensity,
to know Who they are. The signs,
beloved one, are all around you.
There is a Second Coming of the Christ upon this plane,
and it comes rapidly now. It is the birthing of the Remembrance
of Who you truly are: the Christ incarnate,
Love expressing in matter, physicality.
The second coming…. REMEMBRANCE
The acceptance of the Cosmic Christed Consciousness
is something that most of you can accept.
But what about the Christian beliefs
Of sin, guilt and judgment?
As most students of the Course in Miracles know,
the Christ spirit gave us information that the illusion
of separation is what needs to be dropped,
and when doing so, we realize the sacred moment
of all that is. Here is where we find God.
In order to re-embrace Christian doctrine
it is necessary to translate the words
"convert and repent" into :
SURRENDER your belief in unworthiness
and separation, and experience the oneness of now.
It is really the same thing because it helps you let go
of all your false beliefs and accept the "Salvation"
that the Universe wants to realize.
<Rod> amen ;)
James Twyman discusses this with the leader
of the Emissaries of light. While in Croatia,
he asks about the apparition of the Blessed Mother
appearing in nearby Medugoria.
His Teacher answers:
"The Children are not crazy, nor are they liars,
but I will also say things are never as they seem.
Mary's message is essentially the same
thing that I am saying to you?
She asks people to turn away from conflict
and towards peace. She stresses the need
to turn to God, to surrender to God,
and to trust God's guidance. She asks us
to be grateful to the gifts of God, for happiness,
love joy, and the need to give these gifts
to experience god's love more fully.
James Twyman asks further:
She also talks about sacrifice and sin,
now these are things that you never talk about.
When I say that Mary is appearing in Medugoria,
I mean that the children are witnessing a divine revelation.
Divine revelation comes to us in many ways.
They can be a subtle as an insight inspired by a sunset,
or it can be dramatic like an apparition.
The goal of any revelation is to inspire peace.
Every thing that Mary has said is about peace,
and that is why it is real.
But this still doesn't say whether the children are
experiencing the whole truth. They can understand
the truth only within the limits of their concepts.
Out beliefs are like filters that we place between
ourselves and the truth.
The children are Catholic, is it any wonder that they
are experiencing the truth through Mary? And that the message
that they hear would be decidedly Catholic in tone?
What if they were Muslim children?
Would it be Mary appearing to them,
or someone they could relate to?
So what you are saying is that it doesn't matter
whether it is Mary, an angel or the Buddha
that appears, the revelation is a gift
that we receive and interpret with the beliefs
that we already have.
That is exactly what I am saying.
There is no separation outside of your mind.
But you can only see what you allow yourself to see.
<miKron> "Seek Peace not here,
Find Peace Everywhere "
In conclusion, I see what I allow myself to see now.
My ex used to say I belonged to the church of "Susanism", (smile)
I guess he was right. Hopefully, after my years
of exploration and trying to get a higher view
on what it is all about, my filter has thinned
enough to allow many many divine revelations to enter daily.
Whether it comes from the divine Father,
on my left shoulder, or the divine Mother
on my right shoulder, or my many guides and angels,
I give thanks for all the patience and love
that life has bestowed on me.
<Rod> Thank you, Susanrose for a wonderful topic ; )
<Sandra> Hi, sorry I am so late
<Rod> Welcome Sandra, I had trouble myself. : )
<^gina^> I think you have done a good job on a
difficult topic which could be explored more
<^Jbb> when you sleep Gina,
lay your head slightly to the left and ask
Dad or Mom :) for new info.
<JOY-FUL> I feel for the conflicts that created
the need to explore this subject
<^gina^> since a wee child I have always said
to my mother that God and I have everything
under control so relax
<^Jbb> we are and Dad are One.
<Susanrose> thank you everyone.
<DoriM> Thank you Susanrose
<^Jbb> Love to All.... Love is all there is...
love is all there is... love is all there is.
<Joyful> love to all enjoyed being here tonight :)
<Rod> Bye Susanrose! Peace and Love
<^gina^> night susanrose dear love you
<miKron> Susan Rose I miKron would just like
to take a moment and thank you for creating GaiaFriends ,
in the cosmic doorway you have made
a wonderful contribution to help Planetary Ascension !
Additional information on
New Age Christianity can be found here.